PBM Gaming: Expanding the Beachhead

[GrimFinger]

And yet, further down, you say you wish your turns were delivered by the internet. My guess is that if there was enough interest in the game, there would be a mechanism for sending and receiving turns. That there isn't suggests that RSI doesn't believe that an expenditure of time and effort would be worth it.

Of course that I wish that turn results for Hyborian War were accessible via e-mail or the Internet. Of course, there are many things that I wish were changed about the game, too. My wishes and reality are, at times, very distinct things. I don't try to confuse the two.

I believe that, with regarding to the licensing issue, different people control things, now. There's a big online Conan game, now, already.

Where the time issue is concerned, Lee at RSI told me a long while back that there were changes that they would like to make to the Hyborian War code. The issue was time.

Bills are received by mail because it provides legal protection for the biller. There is no such reason for gaming.

Gaming grows up around every medium of communication, or so its seems. Some games have grown up that cross the boundary lines of various forms of communication. I recall one game, from a few years back, that involved e-mail, fax, cell phone, and perhaps more. I never played in it, but I recall reading an article or two about it.

Is postal gaming in need of legal protection?

He'd be one hundred times more likely to conceive of it happening on line. If it was a totally human moderated game, he'd set it up via texting.

Perhaps, so. But, perhaps not, if he wanted to go with something more unique than the standard, common medium of his time. He could use smoke signals for gaming, I suppose, but there would probably be a range of drawbacks to that medium that would dwarf even the drawbacks of the postal medium.

If you build it they will come. Patience in all things, grasshopper.

Sometimes, you build it, and they will not come.

My website is built. It's your game that they're waiting on, now, Jon.

The question isn't whether RSI will ever starting running a web game, or whether a kid would play by mail, by tabletop, or by web if he wanted to have a game with 1/2 dozen friends.

PBM was what it was because it did support a fairly large number of commercial games. It was the commercial companies, starting with FBI, that created the excitement, the sense of community, and the plain old fun that existed from 1985 to somewhere in the 90's. In a capitalistic society, if someone is good at designing games, he wants to be paid for it, not give them away for free.

It doesn't matter whether there are 100 or 1000 PBM players still getting turns by mail. What will keep what was great about PBM gaming alive in the 21st century is whether commercial pbw games that are neither MUDs nor MMPOLRPGs can be designed and operated in such a way as to attract more cottage-industry professionals.

I understand what you're saying. However, PBM's Old Guard holds no monopoly on generating excitement. They also hold no monopoly on interest in postal gaming. What the commercial play by web industry does or does not do, time will ultimately tell. That's something for the future. Rumor has it that some people are waiting to play a play by web version of Rimworlds, but that the programmer is off somewhere spending too much time arguing about postal gaming with a guy hoping to start up an old school correspondence gaming type of game.

And you guys think that I'm crazy.

[JonO]

Where the time issue is concerned, Lee at RSI told me a long while back that there were changes that they would like to make to the Hyborian War code. The issue was time.

Time, especially time you are paying for, is one of the most precious resources.

Perhaps, so. But, perhaps not, if he wanted to go with something more unique than the standard, common medium of his time. He could use smoke signals for gaming, I suppose, but there would probably be a range of drawbacks to that medium that would dwarf even the drawbacks of the postal medium.

Usually unique isn't something you want in the medium, however attractive it might be in the message. The more unique a communications attempt is, the fewer people you reach.

I understand what you're saying. However, PBM's Old Guard holds no monopoly on generating excitement. They also hold no monopoly on interest in postal gaming. What the commercial play by web industry does or does not do, time will ultimately tell. That's something for the future. Rumor has it that some people are waiting to play a play by web version of Rimworlds, but that the programmer is off somewhere spending too much time arguing about postal gaming with a guy hoping to start up an old school correspondence gaming type of game.

And you guys think that I'm crazy.

I'm not arguing, I'm discussing. The more you challenge my assumptions and make me think about what and how I am doing, the better off I'll be when this game rolls out.

One think I find true and I think a lot of other programmers do, too, is that I have X amount of skull sweat I can spend doing the heavy lifting - 8 to 10 hours @ day. Other than that, I can correct the grammar on the rules-books, create new graphic images, watch TV, or make obscene phone calls. Spending time on this website is certainly a better use of my time than breathing heavily on the phone.

[GrimFinger]

Time, especially time you are paying for, is one of the most precious resources.

Amen to that.

Usually unique isn't something you want in the medium, however attractive it might be in the message. The more unique a communications attempt is, the fewer people you reach.

Does that mean that we aren't likely to see any games based upon smoke signals, Jon? And here I thought that I might be on to something, too.

I'm not arguing, I'm discussing. The more you challenge my assumptions and make me think about what and how I am doing, the better off I'll be when this game rolls out.

Is there a time frame for when your game will be out?

One thing I find true and I think a lot of other programmers do, too, is that I have X amount of skull sweat I can spend doing the heavy lifting - 8 to 10 hours @ day. Other than that, I can correct the grammar on the rules-books, create new graphic images, watch TV, or make obscene phone calls. Spending time on this website is certainly a better use of my time than breathing heavily on the phone.

Well, then hopefully, someone else will benefit from your presence here. I'm glad to have you aboard.

I still want to know how many of those broadband users in that CNET study that you referred to also have postal mailboxes.

[JonO]

I still want to know how many of those broadband users in that CNET study that you referred to also have postal mailboxes.

I have one - I try to remember to check it once a week, but 95% of what is delivered never gets into the house. I have a barrel in the garage that I take to the recycling center once every 6 months or so.

[Ramblurr]

Heh, I'm gone for a day and I miss this lively discussion.

My one comment at this point is in regards to the relevance of postal mailboxes. I don't think anyone here is saying the postal mailbox is irrelevant, after all we all have them.

However, JonO, Sean, and I assert that the postal mailbox as a delivery system for gaming entertainment is irrelevant, and Grim disagrees. Though I suspect we've different goals. Let's stick to discussing gaming

[GrimFinger]

Heh, I'm gone for a day and I miss this lively discussion.

I hope that you did not forget to bring back souvenirs for all of us.

My one comment at this point is in regards to the relevance of postal mailboxes. I don't think anyone here is saying the postal mailbox is irrelevant, after all we all have them.

Exactly - the postal mailbox isn't irrelevant. It is relevant for many things, including gaming. The only commercial PBM game that I play at the moment uses postal delivery, in fact.

However, JonO, Sean, and I assert that the postal mailbox as a delivery system for gaming entertainment is irrelevant, and Grim disagrees. Though I suspect we've different goals. Let's stick to discussing gaming

We are discussing gaming.

RSI, as a PBM game company, seems to have survived the transition to the Internet era intact. Ironically enough, it never abandoned the postal service as a primary method of delivering turn results to players. The online player bases for its game seem to rival those of other PBM companies still around, yet who opted for a different approach.

If postal delivery still works for RSI, then it stands to reason, at least to me, that it could still work for other play by mail companies, too. PBM was never simply about the commercial sector of the industry. Granted, the commercial sector garnered most of the coverage in PBM magazines, but having run my own PBM game via the postal service during that time, and being one who was well aware of the existence of at least some PBM magazines, such as Paper Mayhem and the American version of Flagship, yet having opted to not advertise my game in those venues, I have a hard time believing that I was the only one doing it.

In this new era of Internet omnipresence, it is certainly valid to question the wisdom in paying for postage and envelopes and paper, simply in order to get turn results for a game to its end recipient - the gamer.

However, with the advent of the Internet, the established postal service did not simply evaporate. It still exists. All of those postal mailboxes still exist, too. As such, they do constitute an opportunity for those willing and able to exploit them, as a medium for gaming.

Some bills that I used to pay electronically, have long since done away with it. Now, that doesn't mean that I think that the online environment is becoming any the less relevant. Far from it. However, receiving an actual set of turn results in the postal mailbox is still an event.

I don't seek to turn a vice into a virtue. Yes, with postal delivery, players have no real choice, but to wait. They don't wait, simply to enhance the anticipation factor.

Anticipation naturally accompanies the wait. It is not the slave, thereof. Foregoing the wait, electronically, also results in the anticipation factor being less. There's a trade-off there. I don't think it's because anyone designed it that way. Rather, I think that it's simply that way. I think that it's part of the nature of the beast, that each medium of gaming has its own set of advantages and disadvantages, relative to one another.